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Thread: 2014 IIHF World Div.IIA Championship - Belgrade, Serbia; 9th-15th.Apr

  1. #301
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    Just brutal

  2. #302
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hckeyguy25 View Post
    Oh No....
    tough luck.
    israel is back in div2b, iceland wins the silver!
    at the end serbs can win a medal :D


    great result for aalengard&co.

  3. #303
    IHF Staff Starkovs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SloHockey View Post
    Well if Serbia beats Australia in regulation then Belgium 5, Australia 5 and Israel 5 points. So yeah, Hckeyguy is right. But I thought it was all about goal difference not head to head. Obviously I was wrong.

    If match between Serbia-Australia goes to overtime, it`s all over for Israel. I guess..

    But first of all, Israel must beat Iceland now.
    Goal difference comes into play if the countries in the sub-group are tied on points but its only the goal difference in the sub-group, not your overall goal difference.

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by jokke_wiberg View Post
    iceland wins the silver!
    The 30th place silver. They should only award medals to teams that get promoted.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Starkovs View Post
    Goal difference comes into play if the countries in the sub-group are tied on points but its only the goal difference in the sub-group, not your overall goal difference.
    Ok, thanks for explanation.

    What a shame for Israeli team, I was honestly cheering for them..in most cases 4 points would be more than enough for staying in the group but unfortunately not this time...

    Don`t give up! Keep your heads up, Israeli guys! With that kind of performances you should be easily back in 2A.

  6. #306
    IHF Member Cabal's Avatar
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    Ouch, israel knocked out and relegated by late third period equalizer....
    Sad... i was hoping they can stay in this division.

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    Yeah, I am also very sad..but as I said, if they will play with the same quality next year, they should be easily back.

    Just hope that everyone will come. Eizenman 2x, Erlich, Sherbatov, Spivak, Mazour, Frenkel+Birbraer and they are big favourites to come back quickly. Without them it is whole different story.

  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by bekayne View Post
    The 30th place silver. They should only award medals to teams that get promoted.
    Your point is valid, but till IIHF gives medals in each division, it still is silver medal. In div2a.
    Iceland got the best result in their hockey history.

  9. #309
    IHF Staff Starkovs's Avatar
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    Day 5; Game 14

    Iceland - Israel 4:3/SO (2:2, 0:1, 1:0, 0:0-1:0)
    0:1 - 04.44 Oren Eizenman (A.Eizenman)
    1:1 - 06.00 Emil Alengard (Palsson)
    2:1 - 07.48 Andri Helgason (Gislason, Alengard)
    2:2 - 16.11 Daniel Erlich (Mazour, Sherbatov)
    2:3 - 21.06 Daniel Erlich(2) (O.Eizenman, Mazour) PP1
    3:3 - 56.37 Robin Hedstrom (Alengard)
    4:3 - 65.00 Emil Alengard
    PIM: 3x2 - 1x2 SOG: 37-32 Att: 368
    Goalkeepers: Dennis Hedstrom 29/32 - Avihu Sorotzki 33/37
    Ref: Przemyslaw Kepa (POL) Linesmen: Mariusz Smura (POL), Jeroen van den Berg (NED)
    ISL: Hedstrom Dennis; Helgason Andri, Jonsson Ingvar +C, Alengard Emil +A, Maack Petur, Gislason Jon +A, Palsson Robert, Jakobsson Bjorn, Hedstrom Robin, Bjornsson Olafur, Leifsson Johann, Blondal Orri, Arnason Ingthor, Magnusson Jonas, Bergmann Brynjar, Reynisson Sigurdur, Eliasson Ingolfur, Arnason Birkir, Andresson Ulfar, Mikaelsson Andri, Sverrisson Andri
    ISR: Sorotzki Avihu; Spivak Daniel +A, Frenkel Sergei +A, Avneri Tal, Eizenman Oren, Eizenman Alon, Margoulis Evgeni, Kniter Evgeni, Erlich Daniel, Mazour Daniel, Sherbatov Eliezer, Levy Shlomo, Moscovich Raanan, Levy Itzhak, Rosenthal Yuval, Geller Avishai +C, Raiter Denis, Golodnizky Daniel, Lebedev Marek, Ben Tov Itay

  10. #310
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    Tough loss for Israel, hopefully next year we get better results than what we saw in this tournament

  11. #311
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    Quote Originally Posted by IsraeliHockeyGuy View Post
    Tough loss for Israel, hopefully next year we get better results than what we saw in this tournament
    Going down a division will get the right results, don't worry.

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    Israel

    Painful to say that, but isn't this result a dismal failure for Israel?
    I'd have thought, in light of the roster we were able to gather - it should have been enough to comfortably stay in the division, shouldn't it? Except Birbraer, we were able to pick up everyone we wanted to, even some blasts from the past like the Eizenmans. You can say it's tough luck with a goal with less than 4 minutes to go, but with Israel's roster we shouldn't have been in this situation in the first place. and we shouldn't have lost a game 16:3 in this division, against anyone. Nobody else did.
    I grant you I didn;t watch the games, but on the face of it it looks like a catastrophic failure.

  13. #313
    IHF Staff Marc Brunengraber's Avatar
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    Unfortunately, Taldu, you are right. I thought that with this roster, even missing Birbraer (& a couple of bottom line players I would have picked over a couple of other bottom line players), we were going to be in the hunt for a silver or bronze medal. To be relegated just hurts.

    However, when you look at things a little more closely, you realize that in this group Estonia was pretty much a lock for gold, and after that, every team in the division had a chance at finishing anywhere from 2nd through 6th. Our boys were right there with all of Australia, Belgium and Iceland.

    The game that really killed us was Serbia. Given the sad state that the Serbian national competition is in right now, and the relative lack of game play this year for most of Serbia's players, and with our roster, I really thought that we would win that game - and we should have. That first period against Serbia is the only period of the tournament where I could fault the team for a lack of effort, and unfortunately that one period killed us.

    Positives? Sherbatov and Spivak continue to represent Israel with pride, year after year. Erlich and Oren Eizenman have now both played two years in a row and hopefully will continue to do so. Not only have Oren Eizenman and Erlich returned to the national team program, but Alon Eizenman also made his return and played very well after a long time away. Frenkel, Oz, the Levy brothers and Geller all continue to answer the call year after year. The guys based in Israel itself are getting better. Our U18 program won gold in its division.

    If the guys on the national team continue to care about representing Israel through hockey, and if the young Israeli players in Israel proper continue to improve, there is hope for the future.

    This team relegated, and that was indeed a disappointing outcome, and we all expected better. But they never quit. They never stopped fighting. They fought like hell. I remember from around 2008-2010 or so that wasn't the case. So the current blood and guts, never say die, always keep trying to win attitude is a positive also.

    There is no guarantee Israel wins Division 2B next year, even if everyone returns. However, if everyone does in fact return, they would have to be viewed as favorites to make a quick return to Division 2A. Mexico and New Zealand will be tough challenges.
    Last edited by Marc Brunengraber; 15-04-2014 at 22:57.

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    Day 5; Game 15

    Australia - Serbia 0:1 (0:0, 0:0, 0:1)
    0:1 - 57.45 Nemanja Vucurevic (Filipovic)
    PIM: 4x2 - 4x2 SOG: 31-30 Att: 1100
    Goalkeepers: Anthony Kimlin 29/30 - Arsenije Rankovic 31/31
    Ref: Luka Kamsek (SLO) Linesmen: Adrian Cosmin Toparceanu (ROU), David Tschirner (ITA)
    AUS: Kimlin Anthony; Harding Joshua, McGregor Shannon, Stephenson Todd, Powell Thomas, Webster Lliam +A, Graham Todd, Rummukainen Mark +A, McDowell Brendan, Geric Adam, Oddy Greg +C, Sturrock Greg, Kudla David, Todd Cameron, Cliff William, Humphries Mitch, McKenzie Austin, Byers James, Schlamp Michael, Corstens Darren, Stephenson Scott
    SRB: Rankovic Arsenije; Bibic Nikola, Brkusanin Marko, Vucurevic Nemanja, Filipovic Dimitrije, Kovacevic Marko +C, Gabric Boris +A, Lukovic Aleksa, Jankovic Nemanja, Babic Milos, Ogrizovic Pavle, Komazec Dragan, Ilic Stefan, Sabados Robert, Rakovic Nenad +A, Zwick Andrej, Novakovic Ugljesa, Korac Mihajlo, Lazarevic Nikola, Kerezovic Nikola

  15. #315
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    Table and Rankings

    RkCountryGPWOTWOTLLGF:GAPTS
    1 Estonia 5 5 0 0 0 36:8 15
    2 Iceland 5 1 3 0 1 18:15 9
    3 Serbia 5 2 0 1 2 19:23 7
    4 Australia 5 1 0 2 2 13:14 5
    5 Belgium 5 1 1 0 3 17:25 5
    6 Israel 5 0 1 2 2 19:37 4

    RK Country
    1 Estonia
    2 Iceland
    3 Serbia
    4 Australia
    5 Belgium
    6 Israel
    *Estonia is promoted to Division I Group B
    *Israel is relegated to Division II Group B
    Last edited by Marc Brunengraber; 16-04-2014 at 03:20.

  16. #316
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    Stats and Awards

      PlayerGPGAPTS
    1Robert Rooba56814
    2Emil Alengard55712
    T3Marko Kovacevic57310
    -Roman Andrejev53710
    -Daniel Erlich52810
    T6Artjom Gornostajev5549
    -Nemanja Vucurevic5549
    -Eliezer Sherbatov5369
    T9Daniel Mazour5448
    -Oren Eizenman5358

      PlayerGPGAASV%SO
    1Anthony Kimlin52,7692,70
    2Arsenije Rankovic53,4191,71
    3Dennis Hedstrom52,8991,20
    4Mark Rajevski31,5890,70
    5Aleksandr Kolossov31,6290,40

    Best players selected by Directorate
    GK: Arsenije Rankovic (SRB)
    DF: Ingvar Jonsson (ISL)
    FW: Robert Rooba (EST)

  17. #317
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    Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Brunengraber View Post
    Unfortunately, Taldu, you are right. I thought that with this roster, even missing Birbraer (& a couple of bottom line players I would have picked over a couple of other bottom line players), we were going to be in the hunt for a silver or bronze medal. To be relegated just hurts.

    However, when you look at things a little more closely, you realize that in this group Estonia was pretty much a lock for gold, and after that, every team in the division had a chance at finishing anywhere from 2nd through 6th. Our boys were right there with all of Australia, Belgium and Iceland.

    The game that really killed us was Serbia. Given the sad state that the Serbian national competition is in right now, and the relative lack of game play this year for most of Serbia's players, and with our roster, I really thought that we would win that game - and we should have. That first period against Serbia is the only period of the tournament where I could fault the team for a lack of effort, and unfortunately that one period killed us.

    Positives? Sherbatov and Spivak continue to represent Israel with pride, year after year. Erlich and Oren Eizenman have now both played two years in a row and hopefully will continue to do so. Not only have Oren Eizenman and Erlich returned to the national team program, but Alon Eizenman also made his return and played very well after a long time away. Frenkel, Oz, the Levy brothers and Geller all continue to answer the call year after year. The guys based in Israel itself are getting better. Our U18 program won gold in its division.

    If the guys on the national team continue to care about representing Israel through hockey, and if the young Israeli players in Israel proper continue to improve, there is hope for the future.

    This team relegated, and that was indeed a disappointing outcome, and we all expected better. But they never quit. They never stopped fighting. They fought like hell. I remember from around 2008-2010 or so that wasn't the case. So the current blood and guts, never say die, always keep trying to win attitude is a positive also.

    There is no guarantee Israel wins Division 2B next year, even if everyone returns. However, if everyone does in fact return, they would have to be viewed as favorites to make a quick return to Division 2A. Mexico and New Zealand will be tough challenges.
    Marc, but that's the whole point. Saying that we were right there with the others and making it a point in favor of Israel, is somewhat misleading in my view. My feeling was that with this kind of roster, Israel should have been above the pack (except Estonia of course). the fact that were "there with the others" is a point of failure, not success. the fact that we ended up last in the pack eventually is just making this failure all that bigger.

  18. #318
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    I thought we would finish second at best, fourth at worst. It's a huge disappointment to see them relegated, but there are positive things to point out, which I did.

    Hopefully next year sees the Israeli roster intact, and winning Div.2B.

  19. #319
    IHF Member BASSA's Avatar
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    In a few words ..

    Most interesting tournament since we have this changed system by IIHF. Estonia was far the best while the rest of teams on the same level. Belgium and Australia biggest disappointments (good leagues), also the hidden favorite Israel as well.

    Best individual in my opinion Daniel Erlich, with Andrei Makrov. Surprising of the tournament was Arsenije Rankovic, Serbian 2nd goalie who came from nowhere, key player who send Serbian team on 3rd place. Most interesting team for watching was Israel it's no doubt, first two Israel lines made huge mess against everyone.

    Must not to forget our coaching mix from Partisan Belgrade Nikola Bera, (Nickey the Wiki), and Marko Milovanovic. That wasn't easy task to laed a team who had few games in domestic league, short bench, injured players, suspended player, missed player. But Nickey the Wiki was prepared for speed race. Doubtless, bigger success by Serbian team than 1st place in Novi Sad.
    WC D2 Team Standings 2008 - 2009:
    http://www.eliteprospects.com/standi...startdate=2008

    Maybe need to say, we had great contribution from all members in long 7 days. so interesting to read many comments. In my opinion every page on this thread was new knowledge, new experience, new step. Positive vibrations from all sides, from all members. Thanks.

    If someone thought story is over... certainly NOT :) Serbian league is not over, not completed, there is few rounds to play + playoff. Serbian league is not just "Micky Mouse" league as we heard on this forum, maybe our league deserved better name - SEHL (Serbian Elit Hockey League), sounds warmer to me.

    p.s.
    After all Serbian topic received another warning, another penalty, another removing. I know it's a huge responsibility to hold this kind of members, but we are people too, Serb but human. Since I don't see any progress there I suggest sanctions: old forum members may use Serbian part (Bassa, + other blue and red colored names!),.. effect: silence place for reading, enjoying and relaxing.
    Serbian hockey
    Senior 2A - U20 2B - U18 2B

  20. #320
    IHF Staff Marc Brunengraber's Avatar
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    Many of our members, including myself and other moderators, are very interested in Serbian & Croatian hockey.

    Likewise, we view both countries and their people in a positive light.

    Those two forums, unfortunately, have seen an inordinate and ongoing amount of posts that are violative of our forum's standards of civility. We simply cannot and will not allow people to abuse other people here at the forums, or threaten them, whether in a public post or by private messages. Those members who were banned were all given multiple warnings. They chose to continue with their B.S., and left us with no choice.

  21. #321
    IHF Staff Marc Brunengraber's Avatar
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    The IIHF has a recap article of this tournament up at its site.

    Interestingly, although Estonia routed Israel by a 16-3 score, one of Estonia's players said that the Israelis were the toughest offense for them to play againt in the whole tournament, and presented their defense with a tough test.

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    Very exciting group. Congratulations to Iceland who achieved their highest ever placing in the WC. Something they've done for 6 successive seasons, advancing one place each year !! Three straight OT wins could be some sort of record too.

    Geoff

  23. #323
    IHF Member sloklo's Avatar
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    I couldn´t nothing but agree to Bassa according to Ehrlich. He became my personal favourite of the tournament. Very intelligent player and very useful.
    I also agree that Arsenije Rankovic was a big surprise to me. I thought that he wouldn´t cope to play more than one classy game but he managed. He might not be a spectacular keeper but he does his work and is very calm. He uses his size very good. It would be intereseting to see him next season - if it will be an for serbian hockey.

    Over all I say that we saw a good tournament. Amateurs or not all teams (more-less) showed quite speedy hockey with both good tactical and tecnical skills.

    Estonia with Rooba in front was the best organized and physically prepared team. They stayed focused thru the tournament and that of course maximaized their quality on ice. Beating Lithuania in their preparations makes you wonder if they finally can become a stabli first-divsion team? If they can keep out of disciplin problems outside the hockey they certainly have potentials.

    Belgium was one of the dissapointments of the tournament. They seemed very good in their first game against Serbia even if the hosts helped them a lot with a non-existing game-plan and at moments inafantile defense. What Belgium showed in that game was fast and quite physical play. However I predicted a "dip" in some of the games for Belgium. Thats something that usually happens for teams at this level and not only to Belgium. I didn´t expect though that they would dip in all other games exept for the against unorganized hosts. I thought that this could be a small chance for the Belgians to come second after Estonia but I was obviously wrong.

    Israel was an another dissapointment. I expected more with the team they put togehther this year but could now see that something is missing. The quality, at least individually, was there but something else is missing and I can´t put a finger on what. To blame bad goalkeeping is a bit too much when you play the half game against Serbia the way you do or when you let 16 goals in against Estonia. As I said: dips happens to teams at this levels but usually not of this cathastrophic size. In this sense its right that Israel leaves this level. You can´t have this spread of best and worst performances. The other teams played simply with a less differnce in class between their best and worst and that was enough. I wonder if it might have been somthing within the team (discipline, quarrels)?

    Australia did their job. I had the feeling that this is a really good team but that they miss this little "extra". My opinion is that this was the team, besides Estonia, that had the smallest ammount of oscillations in the tournament. They felt "safe". It was hard to find any top-players in team and thats maybe whats missing? A player or two that are "above" the other and can inspire the team to dare to perform just a little over their actual capacity. No shadow over their performance though.

    Iceland had a fantastic tournament and their curve only point upwards. Last season I wondered how much they can develop and I wonder this year too. How far can they reach next year? Alengaard is a really good player but the team in all seemed to be in a very good shape. If I was in a leading position within the Icelandic hockey I would propably start from the question "what else to develop"? They developed so much thru the past years. One thing to develop might be to work with these dips that comes on this level. The loss of points against Serbia was for example unessecery. It would be really exiting to see them next year.

    Finally I came to the team I went to see in the first place: Serbia
    No matter that I am well aware of the situation in Serbian hockey: I think that Serbia took an undeserved third place in this tournament.
    I have a great respect for the guys in the NT. They fought extremly well with a very big heart. However it was so obvious that they haven´t played enough competetive games - not only this year but for a couple of years. There was very little structure in the team and almost everything came down to some individual performances and improvisation. In all their games I had the feeling that the oponents were far ahead in their tactics and had a plan for what they tried to achive. In Serbias case I had the feeling that it was a battle to survive. Our guys somtimes looked so tired that I thought they wouldn´t make it to the bench. A lot of times for example when Serbia managed to turn over the game three players went to change and left only two players in offensive zone against three or four oponents. They wasted lot of chances this way.
    Yet, if the Aussies had a lack of players that could inspire the others then Serbia had quite a few. Marko Kovacevic and Arsenije Rankovic were in front follwed by Nemanja Vucurevic and Milos Babic. Nemanja Jankovic showed some attiude and some skills too.
    It was extremly important that Serbia found themselves a good keeper in Rankovic which stabilized the defence a lot. We can also thank our lucky star that Israel came out they way they did in the game between Israel and Serbia.
    So, even without a basic game-plan, without a league with competetive games (or more-less a league at all) Serbia ended up third.
    That shows a great potential of Serbian hockey. And that makes me frustrated over the sloppy approach both the federation and the teams have towards their hockey.

    I had the pleasure to meet some friends from the closed down Slapshot-forum. This was people I did know only thru internet and not in person and it was great to see them "live". I had the pleasure too to meet som new hockeyfriends too.
    I heard all there analysis and their point of views. Some informations were new and some I already knew.
    All in all one can say that Serbian hockey is a mess involving all contributers to the hockey: federation, clubs, private people and even players. There´s a constant struggle for forfilling own interests and often only own. One point of view that came up from different people, and thats why it must be considered, is that a group of people wants to keep Serbian hockey this way. As long they stay in the second division no-one has to take responsibility. The lack of infrastructure is becoming a mantra but is also useful every time a WCH is sailing up and a risk of failing is a possibility. And as long as this level can be kept the same group of people could travel, they could call them members of the NT and all in all give themselves a status. A bad organized league gives not a broad base of players which makes this status easier.
    Another critic I heard from people indepedent from each other is that some players doesn´t take care of their basic condition either. Yes, the infrastructure is a huge problem, but to keep at least a basic fit with for example running/jogging, doesn´t require organization or infrastructure. Some of the critics said that some players walked in "right after beach" with "beer-bellys" and their hockey-season litterarly started the day they went on ice. And if that is october, november then.....
    These are only some of the points I heard and I could esaily write more about - but I will not.

    However. I had I great week in Belgrade. A huge thanks to all the teams for performed hockey!

    And for all you that haven´t been to Belgrade I suggest you try it. Food is great and cheap - and so is the beer. And if you haven´t reached the status as I have, which means an¨middle-aged "uncle", I just say...maaan....those girls...

    And I still hope that it will not be Serbia who changes place with Israel after next years WCH division 2 A...

  24. #324
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    Thx Sloklo for your tournament recap, very interesting read.

    Concerning Belgium, I'm really surprised they didn't do better, many their players are exposed to higher level league play throughout the year, thought that would put them apart from almost everyone (except Estonia). Sorry for my Israeli friends, think they don't really belong to IIB...probably they would have needed some preparation games with the full roster ;-)

  25. #325
    IHF Staff Marc Brunengraber's Avatar
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    Hey hey........let's not go after the Israeli prep-game guest players, shall we? ;)

    All of the regulars were invited, not all could make it.

  26. #326
    IHF Member fikret's Avatar
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    No matter that I am well aware of the situation in Serbian hockey: I think that Serbia took an undeserved third place in this tournament.




    telegraf.rs
    Srpski hokejaši proslavili su medalju u jednoj beogradskoj kafani zajedno sa Draganom “Dan” Kesom, ujakom Milana Lučića. Kesa koji je takođe igrao u NHL ligi, za Vankuver, Pitsburg, Tampa Bej i Dalas, preneo je čestitke Lučića koji je osvojio “Stenli Kup“sa Boston Bruinsima.
    http://www.telegraf.rs/sport/1032669...ena-pivom-foto
    +
    blic.rs
    http://sport.blic.rs/Ostali-sportovi...rvenstvu-sveta (VIDEO)
    A-light-in-the-dark: Sofia Bulgaria, Skopje Macedonia, Sarajevo & Pristina :)

  27. #327
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    Yes Fikret, but:


    Quote Originally Posted by sloklo View Post
    So, even without a basic game-plan, without a league with competetive games (or more-less a league at all) Serbia ended up third.
    That shows a great potential of Serbian hockey. And that makes me frustrated over the sloppy approach both the federation and the teams have towards their hockey.
    Dont be angry with me F.

  28. #328
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Brunengraber View Post
    Hey hey........let's not go after the Israeli prep-game guest players, shall we? ;)

    All of the regulars were invited, not all could make it.
    I'm certainly not going after the guest players, especially not after a goalie, seems as team ISR could have needed one :D
    I'm just thinking about when the squad was here in Vienna two years ago...was a great time for me and my club and I guess spending some more time together and having a test game or two would have helped them to gel together some more. But of course it is difficult when players come from around the globe and funding is hard to get.

  29. #329
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    Australia lack a natural goalscorer, Webster has good hands but is quite slow. Defensively they are fairly sound but a lack of concentration cost them in 3 games. We were at the Belgium and Serbia games, Belgium were awful, Serbia were lucky. Don't think we'll see Walker icing for the Roos anytime soon sadly

  30. #330
    IHF Staff Marc Brunengraber's Avatar
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    Sloklo - I can confirm that you were correct with your observations about Israel. Unfortunately, for all of their talent, the Eizenmans were back to their "only we matter, screw the rest of the team" type of mentalities and actions......and it damaged team morale. For all of their talent, they hurt more than help the team when they act that way. No one is above the team or the program, and no one should act as if they are. The whole point of representing a nation is to represent it with your fellow citizens, and with your fellow teammates. Hockey isn't an individual sport. It takes a team, all pulling in one direction, and all supporting each other, regardless of the various roles and level of experience - or lack thereof - that each player has. Fourth liners are just as important as first liners - you can't play one or two line hockey and expect to win. It takes a team.

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